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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=DE-CH link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Dear Hua<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>O.K., just to be (almost) sure I understand your model:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>- you have four walls, made of 100% glazing (TMC)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>- the glazing is single pane<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>- apart from that, you have a roof and a floor.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>- the floor is facing what on the other side?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>How large is the space? Be aware, that "SW entering" and "SW (other fc)" will likely include diffuse radiation from all four wall surfaces, so tracking the exact numbers in such an example may be quite tedious.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Your write you get the "global irradiance" by the "other face" value when you "</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> set all each glazing surface to be opaque</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> ". I suppose you mean when you set the absorption to 0.99? Do you set all four walls to the same at the same time? To check the above (additional radiation entering and of course being reflected out again through the "other three walls"), have you tried having only one transparent wall?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Also, do get an idea of what is happening on the floor, maybe split this up into a set of surfaces, so you can see where the direct hits are and where only diffuse radiation is hitting the floor.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I am not quite sure what your goal is, though.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Best<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Achim<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=DE style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Von:</span></b><span lang=DE style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> HUA SUO [mailto:surano1505@hotmail.com] <br><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag, 21. Oktober 2012 18:44<br><b>An:</b> achim.geissler@intergga.ch<br><b>Betreff:</b> RE: [esp-r] Re: solar problem<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Dear Achim<br><br>Thanks for your quick reply and the comments.And sorry I did not specify clearly. Now I also have some comments below.Hope that you can have a look.<br><br>All The Best ,<br><br>Hua<br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center id=stopSpelling></span></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From: achim.geissler@intergga.ch<br>Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2012 18:12:00 +0200<br>To: surano1505@hotmail.com<br>CC: esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk<br>Subject: [esp-r] Re: solar problem<br><br>Dear Hua<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>I am not quite sure that I can follow your points below, but again some comments inline.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Best<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Achim<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>On Oct 21, 2012, at 1:50 PM, HUA SUO <<a href="mailto:surano1505@hotmail.com">surano1505@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Dear Achim,<br> Thanks for your great help.<span class=ecxapple-converted-space> </span><br> Could you also help me with the following questions?<br>1.why the output for each surface , "SW radiation(inside)" equals to "SW rad abs(other fc)", except that the information in the floor does not exit in "SW rad abs(other fc)" ?</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Sorry, I don't know. I haven't looked at the "other face" thing in a while. Isn't "other face" the one facing outside of the zone under consideration? The value will depend on what boundary condition you defined. If you defined "similar" for internal walls, then "other face" will have the same values as "inside face".<br><br>The boundary conditoin is exterior for each surface, I do not have internal walls in the model.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>2.I preset the absorbitivity 15% for the glazing in optical database, for each surface, should the "SW rad abs( other fc)"/global irradiance of this surface =15%?but it is only around 4%.The transmissivity is 10%.Why?</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Careful with "global irradiance". What are you using, here? You should look at the radiation hitting the surface, not global (possibly horizontal?) radiation.<br><br>I got the "global irradiance" when I set all each glazing surface to be opaque, extracted from "SW rad incid(other fc)".It should be the correct one.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>3.I tried to set the absorbability 99% for the grazing in optical database, for each surface, "SW rad abs( other fc)"/global irradiance of this surface=25%?</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Strange values for a glazing. Typical values would be (double glazing unit) trans=60 - 70%, abs=8-15% refl=1-abs-trans<br><br>It is a test I did for understanding the output. When I set the absorbability 99%, I expected for each surface</span><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>"SW rad abs( other fc)"/global irradiance of this surface=99%</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>, but it turned out to be 25%...I also tried some other number , also disapponting result in the end.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>4. Where I can get the absorbed solar energy by floor?</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>For any given surface, I find it easiest to add a small surface with an opaque material I called "sensor". This is totally black (absorption = 0.999). Thus, "solar absorbed" on this "sensor surface" is the amount that hits the surface (everything is absorbed).<br><br>In my case as the floor is in contact with the indoor air, is the output of "SW radiation(inside)" for floor the total solar hitting on the it ?But how can I get from the result analysis the amount of the solar energy absorbed?<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><br>Regards,<br><br>Hua</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center id=ecxstopSpelling></span></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From: <a href="mailto:achim.geissler@intergga.ch">achim.geissler@intergga.ch</a><br>Date: Sat, 20 Oct 2012 19:38:49 +0200<br>To: <a href="mailto:surano1505@hotmail.com">surano1505@hotmail.com</a><br>CC: <a href="mailto:esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk">esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk</a><br>Subject: [esp-r] Re: solar problem<br><br>Dear Suo Hua<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>see some comments / answers below, inline.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Best<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Achim<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>On Oct 19, 2012, at 12:03 AM, HUA SUO <<a href="mailto:surano1505@hotmail.com">surano1505@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Hello, ESP-r experts.</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>I made a model that the all the façade is totally single grazing( material newly created by me) and the floor is opaque. After several test , I have some questions and hope that I can get help from you.</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>1. I found that if I change the properties in the material database for the single grazing, namely ” the solar direct tran” , <span class=ecxapple-converted-space> </span>“solar reflec out”, “solar reflect in”, nothing changes for the simulation result. Only if I change properties in the optical database ,namely”direct trn” “reflct” “abs” that can affect the simulation result. Am I right?</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Yes, the properties "trans" and "abs" ("refl") for transparent materials are taken from the optics database. The property "eps" (long wave emissivity), the geometry (i.e. the layer dimensions) and the thermal properties (thermal capacity and thermal conductivity) are taken from the materials database entry.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>2. For the RES file, “solar entering the zone” is the summation of transmissivity (the parameter <span class=ecxapple-converted-space> </span>in optical database) multiplies the global irradiance for each glazing surface. What is “solar absorbed in zone” ? I checked that it is not the summation of absorptivity (the parameter in optical database) multiplies the global irraiance for each glazing. It also can be noticed that “ solar absorbed in zone” is less than “solar entering the zone” in all the test I did.</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>"solar absorbed" is that part of entering solar radiation that is not re-reflected directly back out of the zone.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>3. When I try to get the solar energy that passes through the glazing and then absorbed by the floor , I extracted the information from ” SW radiation(inside)” , it seems that this parameter is very large and obviously not equal to the absorptivity of the floor multiplies the global irradiance to the floor(how to get this parameter ?). And for the glazing "SW radiation(inside)" divided by the irradiance is not the absorptivity I gave .What is “SW radiation(inside)” means exactly?</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Are you writing out the values "per m2"? SW (short wave) radiation inside should be closely correlated to radiation hitting the given surface and transmission of the transparent material (not absorption).<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Regards,</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Suo Hua</span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> </span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Ph.D Student in Tecnologia e Progetto per l'Ambiente Costruito/Technology and Design for Environment and Building</span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> </span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Il Dipartimento B.E.S.T.Dipartimento di Scienza e Tecnologie dell’Ambiente Costruito/ The Department of Building Environment Science & Technology</span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> </span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Politecnico Di Milano</span></i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><a href="mailto:Email%3Ahua.suo@mail.polimi.it"><i>Email:hua.suo@mail.polimi.it</i></a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><br> <br> <br> <br> <br> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span 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