<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> Jon, thanks for your response, yes the TMC and CON files differs, but they physically describe the same phenomenon: they say the same things if we put the lignes in a similar order (see attached files). What I want to say about order of definition was : - vertices used was the sames but not defined with the same sequence on definition - surfaces was defined with an other sequence too (and differents vertices numbers in 2 files) you can see the attached GEO files for 1 zone. I observe a 0.02°C mean difference, 0.04°C max difference for temperature for zone 1 I observe no difference for solar absorbed in the zone (just 0.01°C due to 2 decimals output from res module I think) I observe a 1.16 W mean difference for convection on transparent surfaces (for the bigest zone), and 4.32 W for max difference. Concerning surfaces temperarures (on inside face), I observe a mean deviation of 0.03°C and max deviation of 0.11°C (only for the bigest zone). Regards, <div class="moz-signature"> <div align="left">Clément MARCEL responsable scientifique et technique <a href="mailto:clement.marcel@viherio.fr">clement.marcel@viherio.fr</a> <a href="www.viherio.fr"><img src="cid:part1.09040209.07070400@viherio.fr" alt="Viheriö SARL" border="0"></a> 22 rue Chateauvert 26000 VALENCE téléphone | 0 469 305 202 mobile | 06 69 68 32 72 télécopie | 0 469 960 594 web | <a href="http://www.viherio.fr"> www.viherio.fr</a> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ce message et toutes les pièces jointes sont confidentiels et établis à l'intention exclusive de son ou ses destinataires. Toute modification, édition, utilisation ou diffusion non autorisée est interdite. L'émetteur décline toute responsabilité au titre de ce message s'il a été modifié, déformé, falsifié, infecté par un virus ou encore édité ou diffusé sans autorisation. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- </div> </div> Jon Hand a écrit : <blockquote cite="mid:2C3CF455489D6B4F95AFAB84847FA413D2A1DC14E8@E2K7-MS2.ds.strath.ac.uk" type="cite"> <pre wrap="">If the order of the surfaces is different the information in the construction and tmc files should also probably be different. Could you be more specific about 'order of surface definitions'? A difference of 0.02C might just be rounding errors in the simulation. Actually for two different tools to produce models that simulate this close is brilliant! And temperature differences are only one performance metric out of hundreds. Look for additional confirmation - for example as for a zone and several surface energy balances for both models. How do surface temperatures differ? -Jon Hand ________________________________________ From: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:esp-r-bounces@lists.strath.ac.uk">esp-r-bounces@lists.strath.ac.uk</a> [<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:esp-r-bounces@lists.strath.ac.uk">esp-r-bounces@lists.strath.ac.uk</a>] On Behalf Of Clément MARCEL [<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:clement.marcel@viherio.fr">clement.marcel@viherio.fr</a>] Sent: 03 February 2010 08:36 To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk">esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk</a> Subject: [esp-r] same model gives differents resultas Hi all, I've created a simple model with ESP-r that contains : - a rectangular zone (3*5*2.7 m) - an other rectangular zone (2*3*2 m) - bases of zones are connected to a ground profile (profile 1 in ESP) - all others surfaces are defined as exterior, except for two (one surface on zone 1 is connected to zone 2 and vice versa) - all constructions are maded with a 100 mm thickness of insulation material, except ceilings that are a double glazing (transparent construction) - no internal gains, infiltration, ventilation I've created this model with the native windows GTK interface (v 11.7). There are no problems with simulation. I've also created the same model with another software and export it into ESP format. The model exported is exactly the same : - vertices coordinates are the same, - surfaces definitions are the same, - site location, albedo, exposure, ... - CON and TMC files are the sames - window native v 11.7 The only differences are : - for materials db I'm using different version of storage (1.1 for the exported model, no information for the model created manually). - the order of surfaces definitions is not the same Can the second point be an explication of the difference of results ? I observe typically a difference in db temperature of 0.02 °C for a simulation on 9 1 to 15 1. The order can produce differents matrix for theses models, and perhaps explain theses differences ? or is the solver convergency criteria that can produce theses differences ? or the method used to solve coupled zones ? Regards, Clement Marcel -- Clément MARCEL responsable scientifique et technique <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:clement.marcel@viherio.fr">clement.marcel@viherio.fr</a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:clement.marcel@viherio.fr"><mailto:clement.marcel@viherio.fr></a> [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="cid:part1.06020402.06040501@viherio.fr">cid:part1.06020402.06040501@viherio.fr</a>]<<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.viherio.fr">www.viherio.fr</a>> 22 rue Chateauvert 26000 VALENCE téléphone | 0 469 305 202 mobile | 06 69 68 32 72 télécopie | 0 469 960 594 web | <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.viherio.fr">www.viherio.fr</a><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://www.viherio.fr"><http://www.viherio.fr></a> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ce message et toutes les pièces jointes sont confidentiels et établis à l'intention exclusive de son ou ses destinataires. Toute modification, édition, utilisation ou diffusion non autorisée est interdite. L'émetteur décline toute responsabilité au titre de ce message s'il a été modifié, déformé, falsifié, infecté par un virus ou encore édité ou diffusé sans autorisation. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ esp-r mailing list <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk">esp-r@lists.strath.ac.uk</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.strath.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/esp-r">http://lists.strath.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/esp-r</a> </pre> </blockquote> </body> </html>