[esp-r] Re: Window u-value temperature dependency in ESPr

Fri Feb 5 09:28:20 GMT 2010

Thank you Achim,
I downloaded it and looks fine.
I already work with this CFC model but I forgot that Bartosz implemented
also the temperature dependency of the glazing cavity!
Regards

Francesco

2010/2/2 <esp-r-request at lists.strath.ac.uk>

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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1.  Window u-value temperature dependency in ESPr
>      (Francesco Frontini)
>   2. Re: Window u-value temperature dependency in ESPr (Achim Geissler)
>   3.  World turned upside down.... (Bob Irving)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 2 Feb 2010 14:51:58 +0100
> From: Francesco Frontini <francesco.frontini at polimi.it>
> Subject: [esp-r]  Window u-value temperature dependency in ESPr
> To: esp-r at lists.strath.ac.uk
> Message-ID:
>        <d2985fe1002020551w688bb21cg3c6fab7215eda721 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Dear ESP-r users,
>
> I have a question regarding how ESP-r calculates the properties of a glass
> unit (for example a double glaze unit with argon gap).
>
> I red several discussions about the capability of ESP-r of reading and
> importing WIS or Window data file, but for me is not clear which kind of
> data espr effectively read.
>
> My knowledge is that, when we specify a glass construction we have to give
> the resistances of the air gap between the glass panes (that is a fix
> value)
> in the construction library and then define the optical properties in the
> optic database (ESPr ask for the angle dependence absorptances of the
> different panes and the angle dependence transmittance of the different
> panes). That?s all! Am I wrong?
>
> Now comes the question?
>
> How does ESPr calculates the temperature dependency of the air (or gas) gap
> resistance between the panes? It is not possible to define the emissivity
> of
> both glass pane surfaces?
>
>
>
> I know that TRNSYS uses the Window 4 model (but, if I correctly remember,
> TRNSYS is not able to consider not standard emissivities for the outer
> surfaces).
>
>
>
> I have this question because I am modelling a family house room under a
> tilted roof. The window is a roof window (like Velux). I think that, for
> such cases, it is relevant to model correctly the temperature dependency
> (also the wind dependency) of the gas-gap resistance.
>
>
>
> Any help is appreciated.
> Francesco
>
> --
> Dr. Francesco Frontini, MEng PhD in Buildings Engineering
>
> ----------------------------------------
> Fraunhofer Institut f?r Solare Energiesysteme ISE
> Heidenhofstr. 2, 79110 Freiburg, Germany
>
> M1:    [+39] 333-3097826
> M2:    [+49] (0)1522-1624691
>
> Phone: [+49] (0)7614588-5358
> FAX:   [+49] (0)7614588-9358
>
> @1: francesco.frontini at ise.fraunhofer.de
> @2: francesco.frontini at polimi.it
> ----------------------------------------
>
>
> The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to
> which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged
> material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or
> taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 2 Feb 2010 15:35:58 +0100
> From: "Achim Geissler" <achim.geissler at intergga.ch>
> Subject: [esp-r] Re: Window u-value temperature dependency in ESPr
> To: "'Francesco Frontini'" <francesco.frontini at polimi.it>,
>        <esp-r at lists.strath.ac.uk>
> Message-ID: <001001caa415$09e37310$1daa5930$@geissler at intergga.ch>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Dear Francesco
>
>
>
> you have it right for the ?traditional? MLC. With this construction type,
> the gap resistance is not temperature-dependant. However, as of release
> 11.7
> (I think it was), there is a new type called ?CFC? (Complex Fenestration
> Constructions?). This type uses the actual emissivity of the surfaces and
> calculates temperature-dependant properties for the IGU gap (and has some
> other quite handy frills). The underlying model / theory etc. is well
> described in Bartosz Lomanowski?s thesis, available at ESRU.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Achim
>
>
>
>
>
> From: esp-r-bounces at lists.strath.ac.uk
> [mailto:esp-r-bounces at lists.strath.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Francesco Frontini
> Sent: Dienstag, 2. Februar 2010 14:52
> To: esp-r at lists.strath.ac.uk
> Subject: [esp-r] Window u-value temperature dependency in ESPr
>
>
>
> Dear ESP-r users,
>
> I have a question regarding how ESP-r calculates the properties of a glass
> unit (for example a double glaze unit with argon gap).
>
> I red several discussions about the capability of ESP-r of reading and
> importing WIS or Window data file, but for me is not clear which kind of
> data espr effectively read.
>
> My knowledge is that, when we specify a glass construction we have to give
> the resistances of the air gap between the glass panes (that is a fix
> value)
> in the construction library and then define the optical properties in the
> optic database (ESPr ask for the angle dependence absorptances of the
> different panes and the angle dependence transmittance of the different
> panes). That?s all! Am I wrong?
>
> Now comes the question?
>
> How does ESPr calculates the temperature dependency of the air (or gas) gap
> resistance between the panes? It is not possible to define the emissivity
> of
> both glass pane surfaces?
>
>
>
> I know that TRNSYS uses the Window 4 model (but, if I correctly remember,
> TRNSYS is not able to consider not standard emissivities for the outer
> surfaces).
>
>
>
> I have this question because I am modelling a family house room under a
> tilted roof. The window is a roof window (like Velux). I think that, for
> such cases, it is relevant to model correctly the temperature dependency
> (also the wind dependency) of the gas-gap resistance.
>
>
>
> Any help is appreciated.
>
> Francesco
>
> --
> Dr. Francesco Frontini, MEng PhD in Buildings Engineering
>
> ----------------------------------------
> Fraunhofer Institut f?r Solare Energiesysteme ISE
> Heidenhofstr. 2, 79110 Freiburg, Germany
>
> M1:    [+39] 333-3097826
> M2:    [+49] (0)1522-1624691
>
> Phone: [+49] (0)7614588-5358
> FAX:   [+49] (0)7614588-9358
>
> @1: francesco.frontini at ise.fraunhofer.de
> @2: francesco.frontini at polimi.it
> ----------------------------------------
>
>
> The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to
> which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged
> material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or
> taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or
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> this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 2 Feb 2010 16:11:27 +0000
> From: Bob Irving <bob.irving at brookes.ac.uk>
> Subject: [esp-r]  World turned upside down....
> To: esp-r at lists.strath.ac.uk
> Message-ID: <2B29137A-B225-4C32-99B9-5CD5A5E399C2 at brookes.ac.uk>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Attached is a screen shot of the first zone I have created in a model.
> After entering the vertices of the zone, I changed the names and added
> constructions for two walls and then did the same for the Base, with the
> addition of linking it to the ground.
> Returning to the wireframe, I now observe that the Base, renamed to
> Bdrm1_floor, is at the top of the drawing and Top-8 is at the bottom.
> I've not rotated the drawing at all (honest!)
> Please advise!
> Bob Irving
> PhD researcher
> Oxford Inst of Sustainable Development
> Oxford Brookes University
>
> 01865 484201
> 01285 650281
>
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> End of esp-r Digest, Vol 43, Issue 2
> ************************************
>

-- 
Dr. Francesco Frontini, MEng PhD in Buildings Engineering

----------------------------------------
Fraunhofer Institut für Solare Energiesysteme ISE
Heidenhofstr. 2, 79110 Freiburg, Germany

M1:    [+39] 333-3097826
M2:    [+49] (0)1522-1624691

Phone: [+49] (0)7614588-5358
FAX:   [+49] (0)7614588-9358

@1: francesco.frontini at ise.fraunhofer.de
@2: francesco.frontini at polimi.it
----------------------------------------

The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to
which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged
material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or
taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or
entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you receive
this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any
computer.
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